Interview with Victor Prokofiev
Victor Prokofiev is the manager director of the Scientific Research Socionics Institute
This interview intended to investigate causalities on health due to relationship interaction under the perspective of Socionics.
Interview conducted by Anna Roman:
Interviewer: Good evening, Victor! Glad to see you again. Thank you for your time and this interview. I would like to ask you some questions about socionics.
Victor Prokofiev: Good evening! Ok, sure.
Interviewer: Why socionics promotes better social interaction, in your opinion?
Victor Prokofiev: This question is very interesting. I have just finished the webinar. We talked to the girl on the topic, how to interact with her boss, as their interpersonal relations are difficult, her boss is a type of ESTP, while she is ENFP. We had a very interesting conversation. We faced an existing set of stereotypes, that she had. The thing is, socionics does not tell us what to do, but gives us the additional tools that are important to use in any particular situations. With this girl we came to the conclusion that she needs to work on her role function, because several times during our dialogue she used such phrases as: “I am fighting,” “I am under pressure,” she acted by her role function and wondered why she had negative relationship with the boss. We came to the conclusion that she needs to use a basic function, which is located diagonally from the role function. The girl began to wonder how she can change her behaviour and systematize it. We concluded also, that she has to use a basic function, while organizing her work and when she is organizing the interaction with her boss, not only use this behavioural way during one project. It was surprising for her to know that the intuition of opportunities, good understanding of the options and situations, could be used in order to establish a positive contact with her boss, also to find new approaches to him, approaches to carrying out these projects. During the conversation this girl got some appeared fresh ideas and she was gone thinking of the changes. So that’s how socionics may help to promote better social interaction.
Interviewer: Very good example. Let’s talk about bad relationships and a bad social environment. Could it be harmful to one’s health, do you consider that connection true? How does the knowledge of Socionics help on that?
Victor Prokofiev: Definitely, bad social environment and the bad relationships, regardless of whether they are based on socionics or they are just personal, they have a strong negative impact on health. The intertype relationships themselves affect our cooperation. In this case, as there are personal qualities, but also each person has his typological features, all the relationships are different:
• interpersonal relations, where an important role is played by social development, education, etc.
• intertype relationships.
Intertype interaction is most clearly manifested in the long period of time by close contact. As an example, if the conflict relations progress quickly in a short time, then the conflictor might seem pleasant, delight, he might seem better (“He can do something that I can not do”). First impressions of the conflictor can be very positive. Another case, if we deal with conflictor for a long time and very close, then intertype relationships begin to appear. This interaction creates a situation where a person, regardless of his intentions, desires, will, begins to “step on the sore spots”, and presents the information in the most uncomfortable way, even painful way. Here, in fact, this is what leads to serious problems. When we spent another consulting session to the firm, in one of the laboratories an example of such cooperation was clearly manifested. Four people were in a very small office together, carried out a good job, their leader did not have claims to these employees. But the leader said that these people are sick very often. When we started working with them, we found out that one of them periodically visits hospitals, he even had gone through a second heart attack, three workers appeared to go on business trips, even without a special need. When we learned of the situation, we found out that there are very complex intertype relations between them. Being intelligent people, they never made up open conflicts, as well as they never allowed battering. All this resulted in the fact that it has affected their health – they started to feel sick. How did we help? We just gave some specific recommendations on how to divide those people for not to sit together, so they didn’t have to sit together for 8 hours in a row, looking at each other. We offered these people to move to different rooms. They continued their work separately from each other. After a while we got a feedback from them about how they became more calm, happier and how comfortable their work has become. That’s exactly one of the ways to solve the problems of bad social environment with knowledge of socionics.
Interviewer: That’s really interesting! When I talked to Mr. Reinin, we discussed Health groups and Bouquet groups and he told me about the experiments they conducted in hospitals in Saint-Petersburg. They studied the interaction of people in groups. Maybe you know more experiments or maybe you also conducted some of them in your Institute? Maybe you examined any health characteristics? Do you remember?
Victor Prokofiev: Unfortunately, it was not like this. We have our own direction, we focus more on Reinin small groups as the important practical tools to use Socionics. Regarding health, the only case where we actually watched it, was just our work with consulting companies. For now, we haven’t conducted any special experiments on health yet.
Interviewer: Interviewer: I see. Good! Well, if we talk about the “bouquet” groups, are all the four personality types needed to achieve a positive effect? Or maybe two or three of types would be enough?
Victor Prokofiev: I understand the question, but I will answer in a slightly different way. We are now focused on small groups within the family or in the company during consulting We pay attention to the fact that gathering a small group on a separate production, to find it within existing family – it is almost impossible, there is a very low probability. It is extremely difficult to collect all four types together. Groups tend to be of a completely random composition and an arbitrary number. Victor Gulenko examined the integral type working groups. We now actively and successfully use his technique , which allows you to show the goal of the group, what is this particular group oriented to, regardless of the members’ amount. This may be a “working group”, “educational team” and other “working team”, that is usually aimed at a specific task. No matter how many people are in this group – 4, 8, 15. A leader can communicate directly with the team as a single person of a certain integral type. Alternatively, if the team communicates with the staff of the adjacent units, it turns out 2 of the integral type, which communicate with each other. Globally, it works well. There is even a type of integrated cities, integral type of countries, but it is associated with the analysis of the mentality of territorial units. With this approach, the analysis of the interaction of cities and countries can also be seen in the way of certain socionic laws.
Interviewer: What is the integral type, explain, please?
Victor Prokofiev: Integral type is considered to be very simple, but it works very effectively. It’s important to analyse the group dichotomies: how many Sensing are there in the group, hoe many Intuitive, etc. If there are more Sensing – then they prevail, put a tick for Sensing. Look how many extroverts / introverts, rational / irrational, logic / ethics. Interestingly, we arranged not only an external consultant, we also conducted the internal consulting at our Institute. We have a turnover, every time we change the composition of the team, we find the integral type of our team. We realized that it works so effective that sometimes we set ourselves the task to pick any specific type of person to change a little bit the integral type of staff depending on our task. And yet, very interesting observation: when the integral type eroded at least one dichotomy, for example, sensing and intuitive an equal amount, the team begins to work less, problems arise. It turns out, a complete analogy with the fact that when a person has type blurred (it is difficult to diagnose), then the person has a psychological problem. The same happens to an integral type, when it is washed away – there are problems. These are the observations we have. And as regards health, we still, unfortunately, don’t have a serious research, probably before now it was not very important.
Interviewer: I see! Maybe you examine people in a relationship? For example, separately conflictors or duals? Maybe you have studied how these relationships affect the overall emotional or physical condition of the person? I have information that the conflicting relationships can lead to serious mental disorders, neurosis, etc. Do you know how it was observed and revealed?
Victor Prokofiev: We affirm and practice shows that there is no bad relationship, “one just needs to know how to prepare them”. There is a certain table, which Igor Kalinauskas  prepared, it is very interesting, he put each intertype relationships in line with some problems (tasks). Interestingly, there is a certain hierarchy of intertype relations: best – dual, then the activation, then half-dual, then the custom, but this hierarchy is rigidly tied to a specific task. What do you think, to which task?
Interviewer: Comfortable communication, probably, am I right?
Victor Prokofiev: Comfort and relaxation. That is a hierarchy to build a “classical” family. If we want to come and relax in a family, the most comfortable relationship line up for this hierarchy. But if people have a different task, the hierarchy changes. We have clear examples of when the conflicting people (two conflictors) celebrate their golden wedding. If you look at the table of Kalinauskus, it is the task of selecting and social prestige, improve their social status. These relationships have helped to make both became professors, doctors of sciences, husband worked for some time in the ministry for a good post. They both belong to the same social level; both of them were very successful. (here the communication was broken)
Interviewer: We stopped on intertype relations.
Victor Prokofiev: Yes. In this case, we just looked at the relationship of conflict which contribute to the growth of social status. We are very fond of socionics, especially me, for consistency. Everything has a logical explanation. It is seen very well through the features of these relations. Who is a dual? This is a person who “sticks his shoulder” at a time when the territory of the family or team invading by someone negatively, by an aggressor. What is interesting for the dual relationship is that all 8 functions are contact there. This leads to the fact that in any case of the negative invasion, any contact function switches on and therefore is becomes less vulnerable for one of the partners. After all, the most difficult problems are not only with the function of pain, but also with a base, reference, restrictive functions. They are all noble functions. Accordingly, next to the dual we have some kind of protection. Some negative aggressor appears, and dual has already stood by its pin functions and reflected the negative, while our noble features were not involved. Accordingly, the dual need to lean on in difficult times.
And what can we say about conflictor? When we make a mistake, any awkward movement, a conflictor immediately reports us about it. That’s a well-known fact, that any awkward movements are usually done on weak functions. And if by weak features you do something wrong, poor, conflictor immediately indicates a mistake and pays attention to it. He says, how it should be done, as a fact this way of communication is definitely very painful. But the interesting fact is that if a person wants comfort in a relationship, he is pleased when his dual protects him against negative influences. And if a person has the goal or will to actively move forward, he wants to be criticised, he wants to grow, to take a step. He receives the valuable criticism of his wrong actions. If he wants to promote the development of himself, how he will react to the criticism?
Interviewer: Interviewer: Calm. He will be glad.
Victor Prokofiev: Of course, calm! He understands that it is painful, uncomfortable. But this is important. For example, what a coach sais during the training session? “Don’t look for a comfort here. Upgrade to the new level is only possible in discomfort. We must get out of our comfort zone in order to reach a new level. ” It is clear what conflictor gives us, huh? If we want to grow rapidly, to correct the mistakes, even if it is painful, it means that these relations are convenient, useful for us. And if we want comfort, emotional rest – the best for us are dual relationships, of course.
Interviewer: Let’s summarize: in some cases, conflicting relations may be considered as toxic, harmful, right? And in some case, they, on the contrary, can be productive and useful?
Victor Prokofiev: That’s right. In a relationship, when a person wants to develop himself rapidly, get quick feedback on all the mistakes, conflictual relationship is exactly where he can get it. If a person wants in a relationship to rest and relax, receive energy, cheerfulness, then he needs dual relationship.
Interviewer: Are all the socionic types of quietly accept criticism, even if it is productive? Or there are people who do not take criticism in any form?
Victor Prokofiev: Well, is not really related to socionics, it is more character reasons here. It is our personal will. We’re talking about some people: “They are strong-willed people, achieving, making their own way” – it is not related to socionics. These strong-willed people, if they want to achieve something, they choose their own specific way. So then criticism is just one of the ways for them which is uncomfortable, it is painful but effective. If a person has a purpose – he goes and gets it.
Interviewer: Is there any relationship that for any purpose would be devastating? What kind of relationship will be damaging in any way? How was it discovered?
Victor Prokofiev: I can not say, to be honest, we are not simply studied the table of Kalinauskas, we actively use it. This table helps us to solve many problems in couples relations, consultation with parents and children, family, etc. When we consider not only the relationship, but human purpose, it turns the output on the solution of problems. When does the problem occur? It actually occurs when the real goals are different from the goals written in this table. When a person’s goal with these goals differ – we have problems, but if the goals are the same – it works. It is tested repeatedly; we use it in our practice of professional consultations.
Interviewer: Ok, I see. I have questions regarding the investigation and examination of vital signs: heart rate, pulse, whether such studies have been conducted?
Victor Prokofiev: No, this is not carried out yet. We studied in our own different way. Of course, we have thought about this, but not for health, but the things that are natural. We see that the type accompanies a person throughout his life almost from infancy. The certain symptoms could be seen and determined from the childhood, 2 months old kids. For all 25 years of practice, Tatiana Nikolaevna (*Mrs Prokofieva, Victors’ wife), we have not seen examples type changes. That means that the type is not just somewhere typed in the process of life, but laid genetically, physiologically. Thus, each person has a mental skeleton. The task of the nearest future – to find where this skeleton is to which he attached the body’s physiological characteristics, it is interesting and honourable task. Accordingly, it can lead us to the quick diagnostics, for example, donated blood – identified type. We just know where it is. In this regard, we have set ourselves the task to run. We are motivated to find the certain psycho-physiological parameters with the ability to rapid diagnostics.
Interviewer: Are there examples?
Victor Prokofiev: Yes, but not here. We still do not do it, but now there are lots of brain experiments studied the right and left hemispheres. We haven’t studied that, but nevertheless it is a fact: there are right-handed and left-handed people, totally different in the points of brain activity, psychologists say that it is innate. Maybe, if you understand how to appear lefties and righties, perhaps because somewhere nearby will see the asymmetry of the psyche and the personal type.
Interviewer: That is clear. But how can you quickly recognize that the relationships with the person are conflict and that this particular person is a conflictor to you? How can you determine this for yourself? You start to get nervous, for example, or there is somehow more impact on one’s health, well-being?
Victor Prokofiev: Yes, I understand the question. Here it is necessary to be familiar with socionics, their model, clearly understand what exactly creates discomfort. If the discomfort goes by your strong features, it is likely that it’s something personal. And if there is a negative on weak functions here intertype relationships are likely to be the cause of negativity. Definitely, knowing the weak features here and seeing how a person submits the information on them, you can decide with what it intertype relationships, decide how to proceed and how to communicate.
Interviewer: There is a lot of information about the visual identity on your website. There is a certain set of attributes that describe a particular type. How do you think it is possible to trust such descriptions, and knowing them, to determine the type more likely? At the same time dealing with it, of course.
Victor Prokofiev: Of course, we use external features for rapid diagnosis.
Interviewer: Is rapid diagnosis usually trustworthy?
Victor Prokofiev: Not really and not always. Rapid tests are mostly not reliable. Here, with the amount of human experience increases diagnostic reliability. But reliability is still low. Why do we use it? Because we use socionics as another tool to influence people. If we are dealing with a business partner, a competitor, we always have a set of own personal tools without socionics, that are useful and work in varying degrees of probability. Not every tool is suitable for everyone. If you want to use exactly the same approach to the socionic diagnostics instruments, it is important to understand that we do not have to determine the type 100%, we simply pretend the type and then use any socionic tool. What may be the answer?
Interviewer: Probably it is more reliable to check the type experimentally, isn’t it?
Victor Prokofiev: Yes, or we have to see what works or what doesn’t work. If our tactics worked out well, what should we do?
Interviewer: We continue to communicate this way as we go.
Victor Prokofiev: Yes, we continue in the same spirit, use this pattern of behaviour. And if it did not work?
Interviewer: Try something new?
Victor Prokofiev: Exactly, we may also try something from the social sphere, try a new hypothesis. In fact, the express-diagnostics gives us a hypothesis. Either we go to such simple methods as a smile, questioning, active listening, and so on. There are many methods that always work. Therefore, if you do not put at the forefront, as a panacea, communication on the basis of socionics, you can use any tool. Another question is, if there is a socionic consultation, we give a person some practical recommendations for the correct definition of his type. Visual identification is important here – this is the initial hypothesis, which then needs to be verbalized. So, according to our observations, in approximately 70% of the causes, a skilled person may determine personality type by simply the visual identification. Therefore, reliability of visual identification is about 70% for an experienced person. On our website you may find a gallery of socionic types. (* Http: //www.socionics.ru/types/photo2)
One young man recently protested: “How it is possible that people belonging to the same type are so different?” But they are really different visually, of course. Appearance provides just 70% of information, although it is very important to know, where to look. There are people who come to us, being diagnosed somewhere in other schools before. Sometimes it’s really curious. We diagnose one type, and he is previously defined in the other type, for example, ISFJ. We ask that person: “What were the main arguments to this identification?” And he replied – “I’ve been told I’m fat and kind, so ISFJ!”. This is visual data, but once you look closer, you may see the important peculiarities of the behaviour, that’s why visual identification is not enough. We always accent that person – is not a type!. Recently I had an article just on this topic. This article tells that the person it not the type, as there are so many other factors. All in all, express-diagnosis is able to give us initial hypothesis.
Interviewer: I’ve heard the opinion that people of the same type can be very different. By the way, here’s an interesting question, I think many of the listeners will be interested: what relationships are usually between people of the same type?
Victor Prokofiev: People of the same type always understand each other very well. This is the best attitude for a couple of “teacher – pupil”. Teacher conveys information so that the teachings of her best perceive. “Parent – Child” – is also a good attitude. This is a very good relationship for the transmission of information.
Interviewer: And what about family relationships?
Victor Prokofiev: This is a question point. There are people, developing and evolving, others are progressing slower or not developing at all. If people do not develop, they quickly become bored. If your partner (of the same type) doesn’t make progress – you will know his actions in advance as well as his thoughts and behaviour, it becomes boring.
Interviewer: What do you think, how reliable and correct is self-diagnosis?
Victor Prokofiev: Here are 2 important conditions: how well a person knows himself and evaluates his actions, and the second condition – how serious and deep he knows socionics. No doubt that the best diagnosis – is an expert diagnosis. Let me give you a simple example. Man is asked what he would do in some situation. He will answer one way. But when he is asked about the previous situations like this, it would appear that he behaved quite differently. Why socionic tests can’t be trustworthy? Because people often unconsciously say “I would have done so.” Unlikely, a qualified expert after the first reply, would rather request a clarification: “Tell us more”. Non-verbal signs are always taken into account: smiling, closing position, curve, body language. Sometimes a person says “Yes” by words, but all his body sais “No”. That’s what I can say about the self-diagnosis. If two main conditions are met, then the person can very accurately determine his type.
Interviewer: I know the cases when person passes socionic test and the results are consistent with his own identity. He finds himself in the description of the result of the test. Does it mean that using the test really helps to accurately determine the type?
Victor Prokofiev: Would you like one more example? One woman studied socionics, and came to us not long ago. We have determined her to ethics. We talk about ethics after the diagnosis, she did not listen and even did not accept the arguments. What happened in the end? She said: “I can not be ethics, because I fight with my husband and I beat my children.” That woman knows herself, reading the type ESTP, and she sees herself through the type ESTP. Most descriptions yet have very many mistakes. Because there is a lot of socially acceptable and socially unacceptable. Does the normal person fight?
Interviewer: Of course, no. It depends on the nature of education, of temperament. Character…
Victor Prokofiev: Even ESTP understands at the level of volitional sensory, power, prestige, but it does not mean that he has to fight. There is a description about INFJ girls. This is a girl who stands at school at the window, says humanitarian topics, never contradicts the teachers… You see, some descriptions require further development.
Interviewer: Do you think that it is possible to harmonize relationships in the existing team, family or work? How to arrange them properly?
Victor Prokofiev: I’ll start far a distance. In the GRTC (* Note – here meaning “NII Gagarin Cosmonaut Training Center» / Russian State Organization «Gagarin Research & Test Cosmonaut Training Center» http://www.gctc.su)
a lot of socionists worked there. We are familiar with the person who was responsible for the medical center, socionist, he appeared at our conferences. We were also at the conference in the GRTC. Socionics is used there, but no creates the special teams of cosmonauts according to the socionics. You know? It is very important. The close interaction for a long time. Astronauts stay together in the closed place for years, and in a confined space the intertype relationships occur very well. But, at the same time, teams are always appointed by the Kremlin. The same thing happens with the American astronauts. We also communicate with them at the conference. They also don’t form teams based on socionics, as the teams are usually formed by government.
Interviewer: Yes, but I remember, Gregory Rainin told me about your common visit to GRTC, and how you saw his book “Secrets of the type.” He told me that Socionics is actively used in space
Victor Prokofiev: Yes, exactly, now I will explain. Socionics is not used for the formation of the team. But when the team is already there, appointed by the Kremlin or other higher-level authorities, socionics starts to be used. In what way socionics is used? It may give recommendations to show where the pain points are for the particular type, also which topics are better not to discuss; what purpose better not to solve together. Certain tasks are performed separately, then combined. There are things that better not to be done together; Some goals are important to not put together. It all depends on intertype relations. Those recommendations will increase the quality of life, definitely.
Interviewer: Does it mean that for family relationships or business it works the same way? In any relationship you can use socionics like that, right?
Victor Prokofiev: Absolutely. Socionics shows us what to get around and where to “lay straw”. There are relationships that can not be broken. Recently there was a situation where mother and daughter came, being in conflict relationship. In this case, there was a question about the relationship. One of the conclusions was not to keep daughter all the time with her. The family has enough money to travel, they also have a grandmother, and of course father. And her mother was trying to solve the problem of excessive heed, over-control of each step. Such close interaction only aggravated relations. In such a relationship should there be the scope of the interaction. We gave mother recommendations to remote interaction. As a result, it helped.
Interviewer: How can these (conflict) relationships affect the human psyche?
Victor Prokofiev: Very negative. Control relations have the worst influence, for example. I have just finished a webinar, we discussed the theory of evolution, where socionics related to the theory of Erikson (* Note – The theory of Erikson http://www.simplypsychology.org/Erik-Erikson.html), he singled out the 8 stages of development, 7 personality crises which people pass. During the lifetime each person passes 7 serious crises at every stage, working out a certain function of model A. If a person worked out the stage well, he doesn’t receive a psychological trauma, he calmly proceeds to the next step. There is a danger for a child, if his parents do not take into account the inter-type relations, problems arise. And coming back to logic, we know that all the problems have their roots in childhood. If in childhood some of the feature had not been properly worked, the problem has not been solved yet. “Exam is not passed” for a child. Conventionally, the problem is not solved.
Interviewer: And what are these 7 crises? Are they all the same or all different for each type?
Victor Prokofiev: 7 crises according to the Erickson theory, they are the same for all, regardless of type. Practice shows that each stage (of 8 steps) corresponds to 8 functions of model A. The first suggestive function differs credulity. For example, 1 point up to one year worked out the trust or distrust of the world. If a person has received this year’s balance sheet, that is, there is no absolute confidence, there is no absolute confidence, than there is a balance, one goes forward. The first function is developed and closed. And such suggestive function is different for each of the 16 individual types.
Interviewer: That is such a function for every type, but each type has its own, right?
Victor Prokofiev: Yes, that’s right.
Interviewer: Can you give any example of such crises due to the types? How did you learn?
Victor Prokofiev: Tatiana Nikolaevna studied that more, actually. The same theory of development was investigated by Ermak, but on a different basis. Accordingly, there is another snap, something that is not in vain this observation appears, continue to actively start using. When we are immersed in human childhood, it is effective. We see the problem. A person comes with a problem, we begin to understand, based on the fact, on what function the problem comes from, we will logically fall into that time where and at what point the problem could arise. It’s like psychoanalysis, psychoanalyst catches the root of the problem from the conversations. Same happens with socionics. We simply define a period when there was a problem, and in this period we find out what happened that time. And then we have the cause of the problem. And when there is a cause of the problem – it is half of the solution.
What we like in Socionics – a quick exit to the cause of the problem. When there are reasons, psychological and socionic methods allow us to solve this problem quickly.
Interviewer: Yes, but here it is possible to identify inner personal problems. Do all the crises occur in childhood?
Victor Prokofiev: Not only. Some of them occur in childhood, adolescence, midlife crisis in 30 years. I can not say for sure, there is an article, I’ll send you the link.
Interviewer: Do you think there is a connection between socionics and astrology?
Victor Prokofiev: Well, some sort of connection probably is.
Interviewer: Have you studied this question?
Victor Prokofiev: Interestingly, long time ago Tatiana, when she had just started to be engaged in socionics, was joined by Alexandra UDALOVA. (* Note – Alexander UDALOVA – astrologist) They had a conscientious job – she talked about astrology, and Tatiana told her about socionics, that this was an interesting exchange of information. She was a professional astrologist. What unites these two disciplines? As a professional astrologist does her astrological analysis, in some moments it intersects with the type. It should be clearly understood that every science has its limits; here it is the framework of their tools, they are too limited. Therefore, some features of the character were crossing that sees astrologist and Socionics. There were no specific studies, however, they should have been done. But they parted ways finally. They had some joint projects, such as: geometry of intertype relations, algebra of intertype relations. By the way, they started to work together on Kalinauskas table. Some of the problems were studied together.
Interviewer: Do you have this table on the website?
Victor Prokofiev: Yes, we have. But there is such a thing “Socionic masks” In situations of a single person interaction is manifested as a different type of situations and for certain purposes. This may be a game, because every person has all the 16 types in varying degrees. Even Ausra said that it is important to work through all the 16 types. This suggests that all people may include weak functions. This is a useful role. “Now I want to look for this man as I am ENFJ. I can simulate this type for my own purposes, but for a long time I can’t, I only prepared to play this role. ” It’s useful. But if a person has a psychological problem, he hangs up the mask for a long time, and he does not remove the mask in the evening, this is called “an adherent mask”, it is a problem. Person, instead of having to switch to the strong function, works as a different type with weak functions. Well, ok, somehow he learned this lesson, learned how to play the role, but success will be low. And if there is a mask – there is a second type. There is also a real type. The two types are obtained intertype relationships. We take a table and look what Kalinauskas tells us: we check the type of the mask, we also check the real type – and we see the resulting problem.
Interviewer: How do you determine a mask? Is it possible to visually identify the mask?
Victor Prokofiev: It is possible to determine by express-diagnosis. If a person is wearing a mask, diagnostics would show it clearly.
Interviewer: How adherent mask is psychologically dangerous to the person?
Victor Prokofiev: Well, it indicates the presence of psychological problems.
Interviewer: What threatens to a person, if he never removes this mask? And he doesn’t behave naturally in his type?
Victor Prokofiev: It is a psychological problem. There are unnecessary negative emotions. Man wrongly held any situation, with the highest losses. And so, if he behaved inside of his type according to his strong features of his type, he could emerge victorious, with minimal losses.
Interviewer: When do you need to adjust to a different type? Where is the line between maintaining a comfortable behaviour within their type and those where you have to adjust to a different type?
Victor Prokofiev: Where is the line … Well, it all depends on the goals. If we want to get something from the person, we arrange under it. But this does not mean that we are always going to be in this state. For example, in collaboration ESTP and ENFJ information is transferred difficultly, because it goes from the base to the role functions. Here, if the manager knows socionics, he knows that it is desirable not to give a lot of information. And if he does not know socionics, he thinks that everyone else is as well to perceive and understand the information, as he did.
Interviewer: But you have mentioned the professional guidance, still remember, we talked about how to choose the right sport. Tell me more, how important is the right choice? Or what is the positive influence of the right choice. Are there examples?
Victor Prokofiev: Very simple. This is a very interesting question. When we define the type of person, then we start to talk to him, we see those who are already on a thought, pondering, “and I did it already, I can remember.” If a man develops himself, we simply explain to him his unconscious action. Let’s say, we “allow” to do so and so. Sometimes, a person forbids himself to do something, maybe environment tells him “It is wrong, so you must do this and that”. And there are often questions such as: “I can get money for what I really love, really?”. People often think that we are all the same, consequently, we all have to do the same things in life.
Interviewer: So you pick the type of activity that is as comfortable as possible?
Victor Prokofiev: Yes, or do we just say that if someone likes his work, he just needs to change the priorities within the job description, change daily routine. Job Description consists from the list of works. We need to try something to pay more attention to, and something – to pay less attention to. And you have to see what would happen to the demand for your work, whether people work with great pleasure. Here the knowledge of socionics purely helps. And in fact, it turns out great. After all, people begin to work with great pleasure. Sometimes people change their position, profession. If you have gained the rich experience, than dramatically change everything from that point is not a good choice, it does not make sense. But to change your behaviour, change priorities – this is what really useful.
Interviewer: What about sports? As it is important to choose the right kind of sports according to your type?
Victor Prokofiev: I guess I would not say so clearly about the sport. My favourite sport can be anything. But what is important here: there is a division between sensible and decisive (feature) – I and IV quadras. Decisive will get more pleasure from extreme sports. Extreme Sports bring them pleasure. And sensible (II and III quadras), on the contrary, do not feel very comfortable with extreme sport. They are more suitable for such kinds of sports where there is a comfortable body-work, like stretching, yoga – quiet, designed to comfort, health and pleasant feelings. Unlike extreme sports, where the emotions, determination, achievement of results are important.
Interviewer: And let’s come back to the health subject, is there anything left? Anything, that we haven’t discussed yet? Perhaps new studies, interesting experiments?
Victor Prokofiev: Well, I say, all is told already)) I understand that you want to highlight the connection between health and socionics. To sum up, a few points are important here, as I said: the negative impact of some conflict intertype relations, about the sport, and that in the family, where it is impossible to separate, the adverse intertype relationship, it is important to follow the recommendations on the distance. It is important to know in what ways which respect the distance.
Interviewer: Are there any reports on these topics?
Victor Prokofiev: There is an article on consulting, analysis of groups with complex intertype relationships, just linked to the health. And as we have decided to issue them. At this point we decide these questions at the consultation: how to avoid problems, give recommendations. But we never describe, because it is personal questions. But we have a lot of other information.
Interviewer: Maybe you could briefly tell me about your report on Reinin threats? What is your report about?
Victor Prokofiev: The report is now very necessary, because the situation with the experiments in socionics very poor. A lot of observations. A lot of theory. But this is a global scientific experiment. Talanov had tried, he developed multiple-question test, that evaluates a lot of different information. But if you do not lay the socionic concepts and wider, and the results are not as specific and wide.
Talanov laid a lot, many things, on the basis of the identified typology. But, in our opinion, it does not correspond to Socionics.
And we conducted, in our view, a very serious experiment, a great science experiment, a lot of the characteristics and requirements for psychological experiments we performed. And now, we began to publish. There’s a lot of material. The problem for many years was unaffordable. Over the years I have learned a psychological terminology. Now we are giving accurate results of our psychological experiment, consider Reinin threats.
Interviewer: I would love to read the report once done, could you send it please?
Victor Prokofiev: Yes, of course! I will do that for sure.
Interviewer: Okay. I will not detain you longer, because it’s late night already. Thank you very much for such an interesting conversation! We are waiting for new information! Thank you once again, Victor!
Victor Prokofiev: Thank you very much, too! All the best
List of publications related to the subject:
VG Prokofiev. “Layer cake” or the crisis in socionics. Cosmology and Astrophysics personality psychology. – 2006. – N 3. Management and Personnel: Psychology of Management, Socionics and Sociology. – 2010 – of N 7.
VG Prokofiev. Bird in the hand, or is it always need a full diagnosis of TIM. , Cosmology and Astrophysics personality psychology “, 4 2008
EAT. MARKET, VG Prokofiev. The natural style of communication and expression in classical works. , Cosmology and Astrophysics personality psychology. – 2010 – of N 2.
TN Prokofiev VG Prokofiev. Research Institute of Socionics, 2008
TN Prokofiev VG Prokofiev, AS Devyatkin, PE Cleopas. Features of the educational approach in the Institute of Socionics and our competitive advantages 2008
TN Prokofiev VG Prokofiev. Socionic approach to improve the efficiency of teaching and educational work of the teacher, the school psychologist. Management and Personnel: Psychology of Management, Socionics and Sociology. – 2008 – of N 4.
TN Prokofiev VG Prokofiev, NM Shifrin. Why me all the time? 2009, Cosmology and Astrophysics personality psychology. – 2010. – N 1. Management and Personnel: Psychology of Management, Socionics and Sociology. – 2011 – of N 4.
TN Prokofiev VG Prokofiev. Why do we not develop communication? Algebra intertype relations 2009 Management and Personnel: Psychology of Management, Socionics and Sociology. – 2010 – 8 of N
TN Prokofiev VG Prokofiev, AS Devyatkin, Y. Isaev. Methods of determining the psychological type of pre-school age children. , Cosmology and Astrophysics personality psychology. – 2010 – of N 4.
GA Malina, VG Prokofiev. “Finding yourself. , Cosmology and Astrophysics personality psychology.” – 2011 – of N 3.